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Evaluation


  • First I must thank Ryan Lutz and Matterhackers for the quick response in sending a replacement Tablet, great work Guys.I am evaluating three setups at the moment. 1)The Normal laptop Lcd SD card configuration.2) A raspberry Pi3B and Astroprint.3) the T10 tablet.
    No1 does not need much evaluation, because I have been using that for some time and am quite happy with it, just need to free the Laptop, so will use it for comparison with the other two.So far Astroprint is not living up to expectations, but will look further into it as I go along.Have put together a temporary support bracket to fit the T10, will design something better later.First tests, T10 worked great out of the box. first print quality shocking, probably due to settings, never used Matter control before, could use some advise on this.One thing I noticed compared with Simplify3d was the print speed, T10 just raced away, I assume this may have contributed to the print quality, still print adhered to bed very well.

    The print failed half way through, not quite right, it stopped extruding half way through, the filament jammed, I also suspect this had something to do with the speed, I have never seen the extruder work so fast.

    This evaluation will be on going.

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  • Hi Ernie! Thanks for the kind words.

    Glad to hear the tablet arrived safely and seems to be working (settings issues aside). It definitely sounds like speed settings are set higher than they should be, so review those and adjust as necessary. I'd probably not go much higher than 40 mm/s for any one value in that section.

    If after adjusting speed settings you continue to have issues please post or email and we'll do what we can to get you going.



  • Thanks Ryan, one must give credit where due.

    Not quite understanding the speed settings, they are slightly different from what I am used to. they are a mixture, some a percentage others not, here is the list.

    Infill 60

    Top solid 50

    Perimeters, inside 30, outside 70%.

    First layer 30%.



  • I recommend you take the time to read through the descriptions of each individual setting in the Speed section I linked to. The percentages to which you refer are percentages of other settings, and all are adequately described as far as which other settings they modify. In the cases of fields with percentages instead of explicit mm/s values, those fields can be either mm/s or % and that is also detailed on those settings pages.

    In case you missed the link in my previous post, here is a direct link: http://wiki.mattercontrol.com/Settings/General/Speed

    At the very least I would lower Infill and Top solid to 40. The others are probably okay.



  • Thanks Ryan, yes I did miss the earlier link.Having now read it, and made some recommended changes, nothing much changed.

    After comparing it with Simplify3d, it seems to be the extrusion speed that is not correct it is just racing away so fast that the filament is getting chewed up, and eventually getting clogged.

    I cannot see anyway to slow this down any tips for that.



  • Can you email me your slice settings and G-Code file? I might be able to identify something from having a look at those.



  • OK Ryan, will do.



  • As stated in my email to Ryan, the cause of the extrusion speed problem was beacause I had the LCD screen connected, and the T10 was not inpressed.😊

    I have finally got a couple of prints from the T10, and I must say I am Impressed, it gave me a nice smooth finish, though it did come with some problems.

    Printing via the Lcd screen and Simplify3d everything worked as per Marlin setup, but when printing from the T10, it seemed to ignore some of the settings,

    mainly, the nozzle height, started printing to high off the bed so it was not sticking.

    After setting What I thought was a negative Z offset I started the print only to find that the nozzle rose up instead of down, what I discovered was that the negative sign was being changed to zero.

    To fix this I had to then delete the zero and then enter the minus sign, then it worked, great if it didn't change when the tablet is turned of, I entered a figure of -.006 and when I switch the T10 back on it has changed to -.6 this caused it to push way down on the glass, I hope this can be changed very quickly.

    I cannot see why the T10 is not following the Marlin settings.

    I also tried the text feature and was very pleased with the way it performed, except for the fact, that thought it printed the dot over the I and the apostrify, it really was a waiste of time because it was not attached in anyway.

    With the present results, I don't think I will be persuing the Astro print any further.

    Another couple features I am not happy with are is the Support, it would be nice if you could see how the support is going to be. also it would be nice if you could add and remove support as you wish. No 2 why does the keyboard not have the arrow keys, this would make things much easier.



  • @erniehatt said:

    Printing via the Lcd screen and Simplify3d everything worked as per Marlin setup, but when printing from the T10, it seemed to ignore some of the settings, mainly, the nozzle height, started printing to high off the bed so it was not sticking.
    After setting What I thought was a negative Z offset I started the print only to find that the nozzle rose up instead of down, what I discovered was that the negative sign was being changed to zero.
    To fix this I had to then delete the zero and then enter the minus sign, then it worked, great if it didn't change when the tablet is turned of, I entered a figure of -.006 and when I switch the T10 back on it has changed to -.6 this caused it to push way down on the glass, I hope this can be changed very quickly.

    My guess is that you didn't enter a real number (mathematics term) soon enough before the timeout expired and the value was set back to 0. It's annoying, and it's on the list of things to fix.

    I wasn't able to reproduce your report of -.006 changing to -.6 on reboot. Has it happened again since the first time?


    @erniehatt said:

    I cannot see why the T10 is not following the Marlin settings.

    Which settings did it not follow?


    @erniehatt said:

    I also tried the text feature and was very pleased with the way it performed, except for the fact, that thought it printed the dot over the I and the apostrify, it really was a waiste of time because it was not attached in anyway.

    Good point. I will file a bug report.


    @erniehatt said:

    Another couple features I am not happy with are is the Support, it would be nice if you could see how the support is going to be. also it would be nice if you could add and remove support as you wish.

    Support material is always shown in the print preview in LAYER VIEW.

    And we agree; adding custom support a la Simplify3D would be great. It's on the long list.


    @erniehatt said:

    No 2 why does the keyboard not have the arrow keys, this would make things much easier.

    MatterControl on the T10 and Touch use the native Android keyboard which does not have arrow keys. To position the cursor, the user must touch the spot manually on the screen.

    I'll make a note of your request but due to the difficulty of using a different keyboard I don't foresee this getting much better.



  • Thanks Ryan.

    The Negative No change, that happened a few times, but it is OK now, my big fingers probably didn't connect the save properly.

    The setting from Marlin it seemed to ignore, was the nozzle height, worked fine with Simplify3d, but not T10.

    Support, problem is, it only shows a flat few, it is there but you can't see at what height its . I printed something with a large curve, and it only supported only part of the curve, hense the rest got somewhat distorted, OK, it's most likely a setting , but settings like small and a lot do not say very much, if we were able to rotate the image so that we could see it side on, that would be a big help.

    Fair enough about the keyboard, is it possible to be able to connect a Bluetooth keyboard, like I can with My other tablets.



  • @erniehatt said:

    The Negative No change, that happened a few times, but it is OK now, my big fingers probably didn't connect the save properly.

    It's not about hitting 'Save' in time; it's just about entering a valid number before the timeout. If the value is set to anything besides a real number like -.0 or -0 it will default to 0 within a matter of a few seconds.


    @erniehatt said:

    The setting from Marlin it seemed to ignore, was the nozzle height, worked fine with Simplify3d, but not T10.

    I'd be interested to see exported G-Code from two very different Z Offset values that adequately show the problem. Can you email those to me?


    @erniehatt said:

    Support, problem is, it only shows a flat few, it is there but you can't see at what height its . I printed something with a large curve, and it only supported only part of the curve, hense the rest got somewhat distorted, OK, it's most likely a setting , but settings like small and a lot do not say very much, if we were able to rotate the image so that we could see it side on, that would be a big help.

    Also would like to see G-Code and settings related to this. Email?


    @erniehatt said:

    Fair enough about the keyboard, is it possible to be able to connect a Bluetooth keyboard, like I can with My other tablets.

    You should be able to do this.



  • Thanks Ryan,

    apart from these few little niggles, I am very impressed with the T10 and Matter control in general, just looking at ways it could be improved.

    I am sure all my little problems are only due to my lack of experience with it, once I get the hang of all the setup features all will be well.



  • 1/8/2016.

    updates the prints are very very good, I have printed a test piece at layer heights of .3, .2, .1, and .05, and all are very good results,

    though there is a big increase it print times, that of course was to be expected.

    One thing I noticed compared with other programs I have tried, there were no zits or blobs. I think it has something to do with None printing speed,

    which is set at 300.

    Then I tried printing something larger, it went fine, until about a third of the way through, then it jumped over about 2mm, and continude printing

    as if nothing had happened, don't know the cause of it yet, so will not point the finger at any one possibility, From the direction of the jump

    I would hazard a guess at the Y axis, perhaps it jammed up momentarily, or maybe it was a combination of that with a little help from the none print

    movement speed. Not worked it out yet.

    I have had problems with the print lifting away from supports, and have not yet worked that one out.

    Another problem for me is that there are no arrow keys for the on board keyboard, Ryan of Matter Hackers tells me that they used the standard Android

    keyboard, I intend to try a bluetooth keyboard and see if the arrow keys work there. As it stands without them things are very touchy when trying to

    change settings, especialy if you have fat fingers like mine.

    5/8/2016.

    The keyboard arrived this morning, and I got it to connect to the T10, but the arrow keys did not function,I don't understand why, because I

    tried it on another Tablet and they worked fine, must be some setting somewhere, may in the version of Android,luckily the keyboard has an in built

    touch pad which kind of took there place, Im chuffed. Have built a frame for it.

    Another problem that I have just discovered, nothing to do with the T10, but curious, cannot get the heat bed to heat passed 54 degrees, had it on

    for an hour, any suggestions on this would be appreciated.

    All in all, I am pleased with the T10 and with the support from Matter Hacker.



  • Thanks for the update, Ernie. It sounds like you're working through the issues.

    Assuming you're referring to Travel Speed, 300 seems kind of high. If it's working for you, no worries, but it seems possible that the jump on the Y axis was caused by high speed. I'm sure you'll figure it out.

    As for the keyboard, KitKat (4.4) Android should allow for some control via arrow keys (e.g. selecting apps from the home menu, at least according to one source). Here's a link to an article about mapping keys for use with an Android tablet-- perhaps it might apply: http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=159538

    Not sure about the bed temp. It sounds like the bed isn't getting enough power. Have you run PID tuning recently? http://matterhackers.dozuki.com/Guide/PID+Tuning/6



  • Hi Ryan,

    thanks, I have never done Pid tuning before, so gave it a try, following the liknk you posted I
    entered M303 E-1 S110 C8.
    Everything traveled along nicely until it reached 45.69 degrees, then got the message .
    Pid failed timed out, do you have a reason why this should be..

    Regarding the power, the supply I am using is rated at 28amps, that should be plenty I should think.

    Regarding the keyboard, As long as the touch pad does the job that will be fine. But I am having a connection problem, it works on occasion, other times, I turn on the Bluetooth in the T10 initiate the bluetooth, and set the keyboard, try to return to the main page and it starts over again, but it stops at loading data, it's as if the the thing freezes, it works with the tablet menus, arrow keys, enter key, so it seems to be a Matter control issue, any ideas.Maybe it's something for the developers to look at.

    Another thing I am not understanding, when printing a fairly large print, it will not show a preview, and during printing it just says streaming g-code, not a big problem for me except I would like to know how long it will take,for others who print for others it would make things difficult for them to give an accurate price.

    Here are the settings in Marlin, as you can see they are set for Ultimater, should I change them to Mendal, as I have an i3.

    // Ultimaker

    #define DEFAULT_Kp 22.2

    #define DEFAULT_Ki 1.08

    #define DEFAULT_Kd 114


    // MakerGear

    // #define DEFAULT_Kp 7.0

    // #define DEFAULT_Ki 0.1

    // #define DEFAULT_Kd 12


    // Mendel Parts V9 on 12V

    // #define DEFAULT_Kp 63.0

    // #define DEFAULT_Ki 2.25

    // #define DEFAULT_Kd 440

    #endif // PIDTEMP

    This one has me beat.




  • It sounds like the bed still isn't getting enough power. It might be a loose connection, so you should check all wires and connectors for integrity. 28 amps should be plenty but a loose connection can spoil the whole thing.

    As for the Marlin settings, I would not change the default to anything until you're able to run the PID test.

    Not sure about the Bluetooth keyboard; are you saying that you only have a problem loading MatterControl when the keyboard is connected?

    If you're not seeing a preview and it says 'Streaming G-Code', then it sounds like you're starting a print from a .gcode file. You'd need to select a STL or AMF file from the Queue and start the print from there.



  • Ok Ryan.

    I will check the heatbed wiring, could be a bad solder joint on the bed.

    The G-code could be the problem.

    Now the Keyboard,, Yes it works perfectly in the android setup, only when I switch back to Mattercontrol does it fail to load, when it does, which is once in a blue moon, it works fine except for the arrow keys, which is fine because the touch pad compensates. I dont think so but it could be me, the keyboard works in other tablet I have, in all programs that use a keyboard. So it looks as though it it a matter control problem, perhaps someone could try this to prove me wrong.

    To get it to load I have to turn of the keyboard, then turn off the T10 and restart, then it loads, so it is in fact locking up.

    Thanks for the input.

    Update! tried it with an STL file and it still tells me that it is to big a file to preview, and still read Streaming G-code.Seems to work ok on the computer.



  • I'll let the development team know about the keyboard issue. There may be something they can do, but as we're gearing up for the release of the next version this might take a while.

    You didn't mention the "File is too big" error in your last post; this definitely could prevent MatterControl from displaying a preview of the part in 3D View if the file was big enough. It also explains the "Streaming G-Code" message: essentially, MatterControl is trying to not overload the memory and so it only parses one line of the sliced G-Code at a time. This means MatterControl doesn't have all available information about the part so it can do the math of how long the print will take, etc.



  • Thanks Ryan for the G-code explanation, but it is strange, I am printing a file at the moment.that is equal in size, now where the other said streaming G-code, this one tells me the print time, odd.

    As for the keyboard, for me it is kind of an important issue, as it stands the tablet is very difficult for me to make changes, but I suppose it's not bad, only one real complaint, everything else are just observations. Being as it worked once, I would hazard guess at it being a bug.Which for mine should be a priority over all else. Don't get me wrong, they are doing a great job, it's a great system.

    I noticed in another post that people were having problems with prints stopping due to maybe to large a print file, what do you consider to large.

    I also had a couple of prints stop today, but I think it was down to the power adapter plug it is very bad fit very loose. I am thinking of changing the power to a local type..whats your thoughts on that.

    Another query, I noticed that if I review a file on the Computer it gives me a print time of 54min, open same file in T10, the time is nearly 3 hrs, why such a difference.

    Another thing, when I do an open with and click Matter control it will not load, I have to do it from within the program itself.

    Another problem I found, when I edit a file and rotate it, and save, it then tells me the file is missing, how can that be when I have already added it to the Queue.



  • @erniehatt said:

    I noticed in another post that people were having problems with prints stopping due to maybe to large a print file, what do you consider to large.

    MatterControl T10 can have trouble with models over 5 MB, but it's hit and miss. Some slice fine, others have trouble. Best thing to do if you're having difficulty is to decimate the model to under 100K faces using this tutorial: Polygon Reduction with Meshlab


    @erniehatt said:

    I also had a couple of prints stop today, but I think it was down to the power adapter plug it is very bad fit very loose. I am thinking of changing the power to a local type..whats your thoughts on that.

    That should be fine. You just want a power supply with a barrel plug that will supply 5V.


    @erniehatt said:

    Another query, I noticed that if I review a file on the Computer it gives me a print time of 54min, open same file in T10, the time is nearly 3 hrs, why such a difference.

    Different versions of the software. The one that's more accurate is newer.


    @erniehatt said:

    Another thing, when I do an open with and click Matter control it will not load, I have to do it from within the program itself.

    Yes, this does not work. Ideally "Open with" should not be an option in the OS.


    @erniehatt said:

    Another problem I found, when I edit a file and rotate it, and save, it then tells me the file is missing, how can that be when I have already added it to the Queue.

    There's some weird behavior with adding and editing files sometimes. It's a bug and should be fixed in the next version.



  • Thanks Ryan


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